Alice in Chains......

[Tao~]

I loved this band ever since I heard *Facelift*........Snoogs sent me a video called *Live Facelift* I watched it and was hooked!!!I have all of their cd's plus many bootlegs thanks to Snoogs....We spent many quality hours listening and watching them......
I do love *Unplugged*.....I still listen to it quite often......
Their music is dark and yet....so telling....the harmonies are beautiful....I love that aspect of the band....

However....sadly things have changed.......We now have the band of imposters recording a new album and embarking on a tour.....IMHO......replacing Layne Staley...the voice of Alice altogether is wrong.....I feel I must include this because it is the truth.....

I still listen to the *original* Alice in Chains......but with the new singer....I will not listen to the new material......Remember....*No Layne...No Chains*..........

[lzzeie]

whoa, i didn't know they replaced him......
that's so pointless.

really the only successful replacement singer i've ever seen is paul rodgers with queen.
other than that, i've never seen it work.

especially in this type of situation, cuz layne WAS alice in chains. he was the face and the voice.

it's a waste of time really.

[Snoogans4Jay]

Sept 25, 2008 0:15:11 GMT -5 lzzeie said:

whoa, i didn't know they replaced him......
that's so pointless.

really the only successful replacement singer i've ever seen is paul rodgers with queen.
other than that, i've never seen it work.

especially in this type of situation, cuz layne WAS alice in chains. he was the face and the voice.

it's a waste of time really.

The only successful one I have seen is Brian Johnson in AC/DC......Paul is good but Freddie he just isn't......just doesn't have the range to carry off those songs.........I don't mind him so much because they seem to be doing it more "Tribute" style.....still I have to agree with John Deacon's decision to not participate. He was not the member I had thought would make that decision.

[Snoogans4Jay]

Okay guys this is perhaps the only time you will ever see me back peddle and apologize. I had no right to go off half cocked and put down Mr. Cantrell, Sean, and most especially Mike Inez. I still feel it is not really Alice In Chains without Layne but it was wrong to have such a hate on against the remaining band. They survived. That is pretty damn admirable for a Seattle grunge band. Jerry has fought his own demons and came out so far on top. I am sure where he is now Layne is proud of him. I can't say what Jerry feels or felt. His words in his songs really are the only record and they speak pretty plainly and always have of frustration and anger at watching a friend die. I can understand that. Good luck to you guys. Remember Layne.

[bromleyboy]

No-one can replace Layne, but shit I gotta admit their new stuff COOKS. It's like old days, especially this.

[Layne4ever]

I must wholeheartedly agree, Alice in Chains is not, and never will be, the same without Layne, who I have loved more than anyone on earth since I was 15, when Facelift first came out in 1990....my love for him grew over the years as soon as subsequent Alice albums were released. I have to say in all honesty, I have never heard a singer quite like him, and I don't think I ever will again. He gives so much feelings to the lyrics, many of which he wrote himself, and he was definitely a natural born artist....poetry, drawing, painting, photography....anything to do with the visual arts on top of his incredible vocal talent and showmanship during any Alice concerts. There are a lot of other bands I love, including the Sex Pistols, but Alice in Chains will always be my favorite band, and Layne Staley my favorite singer, hands down....RIP Layne, I hope you have finally found the inner peace that eluded you so much during your life...

[Snoogans4Jay]

I have heard some of the new record and if it were Jerry Cantrell solo I would stand behind it 100%. As it is, I can only say that they are drawing on the name that Layne came up with to sell records. That is very sad since Mr. Cantrell, Sean, and Mikey #2 are men of great talent that could use that talent to make Layne very proud on their own merits.

[Shan]

To me the new record is as good as the old ones. It is in the same style and should appeal to the same audience. The singer is not the band entire.

[Layne4ever]

Nov 28, 2009 13:41:52 GMT -5 Snoogans4Jay said:

I have heard some of the new record and if it were Jerry Cantrell solo I would stand behind it 100%. As it is, I can only say that they are drawing on the name that Layne came up with to sell records. That is very sad since Mr. Cantrell, Sean, and Mikey #2 are men of great talent that could use that talent to make Layne very proud on their own merits.

I have to agree, especially regarding the part about drawing on the name Layne came up with to sell records. It is unquestionably true that Jerry, Mikey#2 and Sean have more than enough talent to make Layne proud on their own merits; one only has to listen to Jerry's solo albums to hear an example of that talent. The one thing I will say, as much as it bothers me that they are carrying on with a new singer, is that I must agree with Shan about the fact that, thank God, they didn't change their sound. That would have REALLY pissed me off. If you take the fact that someone else is singing lead vocals, so that it is no longer an evaluative factor, you can almost hear the same kind of sound Alice used on Tripod on this new album...the same parallel fourths and fifths for harmony instead of thirds, which I think of as Alice's signature...the chromatic chords on the guitars, and that chromatic (half step) slide on the "ohhh yeaaah"s that Layne perfected, made his signature, and that no one else on the planet could duplicate...but you CAN hear the style on "Check my Brain"...great sound, but of course it would have been perfect if it had been Layne singing it.

[Snoogans4Jay]

Nov 29, 2009 14:54:45 GMT -5 Layne4ever said:

Nov 28, 2009 13:41:52 GMT -5 Snoogans4Jay said:

I have heard some of the new record and if it were Jerry Cantrell solo I would stand behind it 100%. As it is, I can only say that they are drawing on the name that Layne came up with to sell records. That is very sad since Mr. Cantrell, Sean, and Mikey #2 are men of great talent that could use that talent to make Layne very proud on their own merits.

I have to agree, especially regarding the part about drawing on the name Layne came up with to sell records. It is unquestionably true that Jerry, Mikey#2 and Sean have more than enough talent to make Layne proud on their own merits; one only has to listen to Jerry's solo albums to hear an example of that talent. The one thing I will say, as much as it bothers me that they are carrying on with a new singer, is that I must agree with Shan about the fact that, thank God, they didn't change their sound. That would have REALLY pissed me off. If you take the fact that someone else is singing lead vocals, so that it is no longer an evaluative factor, you can almost hear the same kind of sound Alice used on Tripod on this new album...the same parallel fourths and fifths for harmony instead of thirds, which I think of as Alice's signature...the chromatic chords on the guitars, and that chromatic (half step) slide on the "ohhh yeaaah"s that Layne perfected, made his signature, and that no one else on the planet could duplicate...but you CAN hear the style on "Check my Brain"...great sound, but of course it would have been perfect if it had been Layne singing it.

While I must agree that the sound is the same, the very fact that it IS the same bothers me very very much. It is like some nightmare where you think you are at an AIC show, you hear the music start up, hear the familiar vocal sounds, but the voice is all wrong. You look at the stage in horror and realize HE is not there. And never will be again. I hate that. As I said, I could accept the music if it were Cantrell solo. Not this way. This way is saying Layne was insignificant. I know you think the singer is not the band Shandon. But I could never listen to your songs ever again without YOU singing them, would you want me to? Would you want me to think they were just as good without you making them real? I hope not. People are not interchangeable. Not to me. Layne's unique sound made that band as much as the musical sound if not more so. It was his voice that spoke to me, his emotion. I won't buy the new CD.

[Shan]

Nov 30, 2009 11:26:46 GMT -5 Snoogans4Jay said:

Nov 29, 2009 14:54:45 GMT -5 Layne4ever said:

I have to agree, especially regarding the part about drawing on the name Layne came up with to sell records. It is unquestionably true that Jerry, Mikey#2 and Sean have more than enough talent to make Layne proud on their own merits; one only has to listen to Jerry's solo albums to hear an example of that talent. The one thing I will say, as much as it bothers me that they are carrying on with a new singer, is that I must agree with Shan about the fact that, thank God, they didn't change their sound. That would have REALLY pissed me off. If you take the fact that someone else is singing lead vocals, so that it is no longer an evaluative factor, you can almost hear the same kind of sound Alice used on Tripod on this new album...the same parallel fourths and fifths for harmony instead of thirds, which I think of as Alice's signature...the chromatic chords on the guitars, and that chromatic (half step) slide on the "ohhh yeaaah"s that Layne perfected, made his signature, and that no one else on the planet could duplicate...but you CAN hear the style on "Check my Brain"...great sound, but of course it would have been perfect if it had been Layne singing it.

While I must agree that the sound is the same, the very fact that it IS the same bothers me very very much. It is like some nightmare where you think you are at an AIC show, you hear the music start up, hear the familiar vocal sounds, but the voice is all wrong. You look at the stage in horror and realize HE is not there. And never will be again. I hate that. As I said, I could accept the music if it were Cantrell solo. Not this way. This way is saying Layne was insignificant. I know you think the singer is not the band Shandon. But I could never listen to your songs ever again without YOU singing them, would you want me to? Would you want me to think they were just as good without you making them real? I hope not. People are not interchangeable. Not to me. Layne's unique sound made that band as much as the musical sound if not more so. It was his voice that spoke to me, his emotion. I won't buy the new CD.

You are passionate for him Lizzie but a singer is not a band entire as I said. I WOULD want you to still think my songs are good. If a song is not good with any artist covering it, it is not worth it's merit. I am a composer as well as a musician and I would like to think my music will live on. I know you don't understand that because you get very personal with the performers you like. I enjoy the art and the compositions. That is a very real difference. I think it is possible that your friend, being a musician herself, understands more that angle.

[Snoogans4Jay]

Dec 1, 2009 2:14:29 GMT -5 Shan said:

Nov 30, 2009 11:26:46 GMT -5 Snoogans4Jay said:

While I must agree that the sound is the same, the very fact that it IS the same bothers me very very much. It is like some nightmare where you think you are at an AIC show, you hear the music start up, hear the familiar vocal sounds, but the voice is all wrong. You look at the stage in horror and realize HE is not there. And never will be again. I hate that. As I said, I could accept the music if it were Cantrell solo. Not this way. This way is saying Layne was insignificant. I know you think the singer is not the band Shandon. But I could never listen to your songs ever again without YOU singing them, would you want me to? Would you want me to think they were just as good without you making them real? I hope not. People are not interchangeable. Not to me. Layne's unique sound made that band as much as the musical sound if not more so. It was his voice that spoke to me, his emotion. I won't buy the new CD.

You are passionate for him Lizzie but a singer is not a band entire as I said. I WOULD want you to still think my songs are good. If a song is not good with any artist covering it, it is not worth it's merit. I am a composer as well as a musician and I would like to think my music will live on. I know you don't understand that because you get very personal with the performers you like. I enjoy the art and the compositions. That is a very real difference. I think it is possible that your friend, being a musician herself, understands more that angle.

Oh Sweet Boy I get that you want your songs to be timeless and eternal. Of course you do. But I LOVE you and I only want to hear YOU sing them and perform them. Because I love you and am close to you. Do you get that? Layne is the same in an intense and lesser way. I love him too and want to only hear HIS music performed by HIM. Can't you see? It isn't about your musical prowess or the way you write or the technical ability with which you perform . It is about love, respect, affection, caring.......dammit just all those HUMAN things that make us love those that we LOVE. I LOVE you. And we LOVED and LOVE Layne. Get it? Please?

[Shan]

Dec 1, 2009 4:57:00 GMT -5 Snoogans4Jay said:

Dec 1, 2009 2:14:29 GMT -5 Shan said:

You are passionate for him Lizzie but a singer is not a band entire as I said. I WOULD want you to still think my songs are good. If a song is not good with any artist covering it, it is not worth it's merit. I am a composer as well as a musician and I would like to think my music will live on. I know you don't understand that because you get very personal with the performers you like. I enjoy the art and the compositions. That is a very real difference. I think it is possible that your friend, being a musician herself, understands more that angle.

Oh Sweet Boy I get that you want your songs to be timeless and eternal. Of course you do. But I LOVE you and I only want to hear YOU sing them and perform them. Because I love you and am close to you. Do you get that? Layne is the same in an intense and lesser way. I love him too and want to only hear HIS music performed by HIM. Can't you see? It isn't about your musical prowess or the way you write or the technical ability with which you perform . It is about love, respect, affection, caring.......dammit just all those HUMAN things that make us love those that we LOVE. I LOVE you. And we LOVED and LOVE Layne. Get it? Please?

I get that Liz. However, love has nothing to do with whether or not a song is worth a sh*t or not. That is all I am saying. If the songs are good and if the music is good it will stand on its own.

[Layne4ever]

I must start by saying that, even as someone with a degree in music performance, theory, and composition, I will not be purchasing the new CD either. I can be more objective with almost any other band on earth, but just not with Alice. I do agree with Liz when she talks about hearing the vocals start up and the horror of knowing that Layne is not there, and never will be there; I feel exactly the same way -- I hate it. Of course a lot of bands/musicians want their music to be eternal, but there are some bands that have to pack it in for good, or that you never see tribute bands (or rarely see) of, because either the whole band, or more often, the singer, is too difficult to either replace or come close to duplicating. I have never heard a Queen tribute band, for instance, and the way they harmonize together, I'm not at all surprised. I also have yet to see anyone in a Queensryche tribute band, because Geoff Tate's vocals are so powerful, almost operatic sounding. On the other hand, Rob (I forget his last name), the bassist who replaced Jason Newstead in Metallica, is pulling his weight just fine, so far as I can tell. Of course, everyone knows a bassist is a lot different from being a frontman. Bassists are almost always the "invisible men" of the rock world. There are several exceptions, of course -- Paul McCartney, for one -- but they only prove the rule. Sometimes you find one who is on more equal footing with the rest of the band, so to speak -- Nikki Sixx is one of them, because with only a couple of exceptions, he was Motley Crue's main lyricist. As you said, Shan (with the exception of Alice, of course, which is really personal to me and always will be), I do understand the musician angle because of my studies, and I can tell when a band is excellent, good, mediocre, or just plain sucks without personal opinion coming into it. By that, I mean I can hear if the singer can't sing in tune continuously, or if the guitar playing is sloppy, etc. It is sometimes appalling what bands you see on VH1 or MTV that are rising into the top 20, and you listen to them and wonder how the hell they ever got a record deal in the first place. I've loved rock music ever since I was 8 and, besides listening to what was current in 1983 (for me, Cyndi Lauper was my favorite back then; I got into hard rock in middle school), my dad schooled me in 50s music. However, Classical is my main area of expertise (by Classical, I mean not just Mozart, but even further back, to Medieval music and such; it is what I sang in college and what I sing in the choir I'm with now). But, we wouldn't have the music we have today without all that stuff! As a general rule, though, if you were to look in my CD player, you'd find something like Alice (obviously), Metallica, Anthrax, Nirvana, etc. I think if songs really ARE good, they will be timeless and eternal, one way or another. I just can't imagine going to an Alice concert now and seeing someone else at the mike, which is why I will never go.

[Snoogans4Jay]

I do think I tend to get attached to band members personally. For instance L4E mentioned Robert Trujillo fitting in perfectly with Metallica. Not to me. It breaks my heart every time I see them without Newsted. I understand how people felt when Cliff passed on and Jason replaced him, but to me Jason was such a regular guy, a FAN AND a musician. Something you so rarely see. I will NEVER forget watching him actually take the time to draw the Metallica logo on the back of a fan's jacket before signing it. "It will look cool, trust me" he said to the fan. My God. What a guy. I love James and Lars and Kirk but Jason was RIGHT about them doing all that public whining and public therapy. Just PLAY guys. Anyhows.............sorry, I didn't mean to make this a Metallica thread, that just struck a chord with me.

Also, I would like to say Queen have it right. They are continuing to perform with Paul Rogers but rather than saying Paul is Fred's replacement they are calling their shows a Tribute. How wonderful and appropriate. Even so, John Deacon chose to not participate because it wouldn't be the same to him. The remaining members respected his decision and did not attack him in the press. That was mutual respect all around in my opinion.

Yes Shandon I know I get personal about the music and bands I listen to but it is more than the music to me. That is just how non musician fans are at times